You know what ? I’m all at your side. French is my native language, and no matter how deep is my love for this language, I hate it in the same time for structuring my thoughts in such a gender binary.
It makes me sad when foreigners are all softened about “how cute” it is to feminize or masculinize every single objects and abstract things. No it’s not cute. It’s fucked up. It’s like if it’s been instillated into your veins, in every corners of your reflexions. Sometimes I feel hopeless about the sexism and the gender-matter when I have to talk about in French, cause I don’t know how we can even comprehend it with the way we talk. God, we don’t even have a correct word for “gender” !!!
I LOVE to write and speak in english especially cause it’s neutral, and allows me more fluidity. So, YES, the gender reflexion about the language IS important. Language needs to evolve to fit the society and the people that speak it.
By the way : women are NOT a minority. It’s half the human beings.
When speaking or writing in French, one is systematically forced to gender individuals through the gender of the nouns, pronouns, adjectives and past participles used to refer to them or to describe them or their actions. The grammatical rules also prescribe that any plural entity that includes one or more masculine individuals or items must be gendered as masculine, no matter how many feminine individuals or items are also included. The gender binary and its corollary of male supremacy are thus constructed and enforced through the use of language itself. It is common practice in feminist and queer texts to use both genders in written and spoken French. However, this practice reinforces the gender binary by excluding individuals whose identity does not correspond entirely or even in part to either of its two genders and for whom this binary norm is thus oppressive. This workshop aims to combat this oppression inflicted by the French language by collectively identifying problematic linguistic situations and by proposing ways of speaking and writing in French in a neutral way: different formulations, new letters, new words? We could possibly produce a reference e-zine from the results of the workshop.
THIS IS RELEVANT TO MY INTERESTS/LIFE/HOW MANY ARGUMENTS HAVE I HAD WITH PEOPLE ABOUT THIS.
yes let’s reconstruct an entire language just to please the minority
this is completely acceptable
i am going to bed i cannot handle this bullshit any longer
What in the holy fuck
Yeah things that are usually masculine use the masculine form of the pronoun
BUT SO DO THINGS THAT ARE BOTH
SAME WITH THE FEMININE
LE CHAPEAU; LA VOITURE
Men and women use hats and cars equally you fucks
The French language is one of the most beautiful things on the planet
If I meet anyone actually supporting this, I will slap them
Does anyone actually get offended because something like a hat has a fucking masculine pronoun? Does that make anyone feel oppressed? Jesus goddamn
i tend to avoid tumblr “discussions” like the plague, but wow. first things first, STEP OFF. as ice cube so eloquently puts it: check yourself before you wreck yourself.
how is it “bullshit” to want to look into the beauty, history and rules of a language in order to adapt it to current realities? how is it decidely worthy of slapping people who are interested in deconstructing and talking about language? this isn’t about people being “offended” by what random noun like “hat” or “car” being gendered as one or the other; it is about a conversation about how pervasive something like the (yeah, generally speaking really heteronormative and oppressive) gender binary to the point where it even impacts the way we speak.
i specifically posted this because it reflects my own personal relationship to the french language, and i’m really glad that other people are asking those questions, too. growing up i was consistently mocked for “mis”gendering things; saying something like, “il est ma meilleure amie” when talking about a boy, and people would use those “mistakes” as an excuse to say i wasn’t “french enough.” this lead me for years to hate and deny a huge part of my cultural identity, mainly because of my peers and my teachers chiding me for referring to myself as “il” or even, yes, misgendering a fucking car or a hat. when i finally had the choice i switched to an english school, and spent years losing a language i otherwise loved. i’m glad i’m at the point where i am in love with french again, where i feel i’ve reconnected to this beautiful language.
moi j’suis vraiment d’accord que la langue française est magnifique, mais se poser des questions sur ses origines et ses structures, ca ne mérite vraiment pas une claque, quand même. être cave comme vous deux, pis traiter les gens qui posent des questions comme des “fucks,” ça, par contre, je pense que ca merite au moins un ptit “fuck you.
part of the beauty of language is that it can be deconstructed, reconstructed, evolve, flourish. for me, thinking of ways and moving towards gender neutrality is just basic human respect. it’s not bending over backwards to “just to please the minority.” it’s having thought provoking, interesting, complicated conversations (which can be really satisfying and enjoyable, if you ever tried it!) as someone who is bilingual, who rejects the gender binary, who is queer, who has friends who use gender neutral pronouns, who has friends who are genderqueer, it is so satisfying to have conversations about gender and the french language. i’ve had friends who have asked people use “them” or “they” in english, but there is no french equivalent. where are the conversations about zie, zey, hir, in french? i want to find them! i want to have them! it is nice to hear people’s suggestions. i want to be able to write “j’ai parlée avec mon amie” and use a pronoun that reflects them and their identity, and not scratch my head over whether or not to put an E at the end or not. i want to be able to not put an “e” after parlé and not have francophones assume that it is because my french simply isn’t “good” enough, but maybe because i don’t feel the need to gender myself all the time. if you don’t relate, and this doesn’t speak to your experience, that doesn’t give you the right to be a dismissive jerk about it.
but i suppose most of those concepts would be way over the heads of people who incite violence towards anyone who may present an opinion that differs from their own. comme on dit dans du bon français: VAS CHIER.
what always pisses me off the most about these kinds of discussions is that the people who it affects the least tend to get the most defensive and angry. really, if you think about it, the people whose identities have been and are still erased by something as supposedly “objective” as language should be the ones flying into a rage and saying “What in the holy fuck.” but instead, you know, self-righteousness abounds and a self-proclaimed “hipster piece of shit” rants about not being able to handle this bullshit. fun times.